18/02/10 – Toronto – Apt./Lofts

Posted on: February 18th, 2010 | 23 Comments

Thank you for voting.

Loading ... Loading ...

Visit the Nominees for the Slowest townhouse in Los Angeles


Slow Home Test Results (PDF)
Glas – Penthouse 6
Charlie Condos – Voile
Seventy 5 – Layout 16

  • James Scott

    Sorry but the Voile link takes us to a housing project in California. I think the TTC only goes as far as Kipling.

  • Mid America Mom

    HI found a link to that plan. This is from Great Gulf Homes Developers.

    http://www.charliecondos.com/plans_details.php?id=556

  • Mid America Mom

    I amsurprised. None of these finalists are GREEN (from what I can tell, LEED, adaptive reuse, or featured on the sites) …. even after altering the test this week.

  • John Brown

    Greeting from sunny LA.

    Matthew and I have arrived and over the next two days we are going to meet with the 4 award winners and interview them for the site. This certainly beats the Calgary winter snow.

    We just realized there was a technical glitch yesterday that prevented some of the floor plans from being posted yesterday. Our apologies. We will have them reposted in today’s segment.

    Have fun voting. Tomorrow’s segment is going to be from the beach in Santa Monica (as long as we can get the technology to cooperate).

  • MollyK

    Good morning,
    Given the differences in sq. footage of these nominees (no maximum requirement of 1000 sq ft as in LA),I thought a review of room dimensions seemed pertinent. I was especially concerned when I compared the square footage and room layouts of Charlie Condo and Seventy 5. How could a space of only 834 sq ft (Charlie) get 2 bedrooms (with full baths!) to look so spacious while a space of 887 sq ft (Seventy 5)had only 1 bedroom (and I was still troubled by inadequate space for the dining table in the open living area)? So I decided to look closer at bedroom size. According to John’s tutorial on bedrooms (6/9/09), as a rule of thumb a bedroom should be at least 10×10 and have a bed that is “readily available from both sides, otherwise you’re just sleeping in a closet”–direct quote. I put a full bed (standard industry size: 54″ wide by 75″ long) with 2 side tables (arbitrarily measuring a meager 1’6″ each) in a 10×10 bedroom and came up with the following approximate measurements for the walking area around the bed: 33″ of space (just over 3′) on either side of the bed for walking and 45″ of space (just under 4′) in front of the bed. And I didn’t include a closet that could take up more of the room’s dimension.
    If you put the same furniture setup in the 2nd bedroom (9’8″x8′)of the Charlie Condos-Voile and do the math the results are sobering!!! Now the walk space beside the bed becomes 13″ on each side and only 21″ at the foot of the bed.(The layout shows a full bed in that room.)
    The results put a new perspective on what is livable in these small residents. Now I realize what looks good on paper (i.e., furniture drawings on the floorplan) is not always the reality of the space. I wonder how many of these floorplans are scored higher than they should be without careful scrutiny of the actual dimensions. Perhaps we need to use our rulers, measuring tapes, and calculators (me included) in addition to our eyes as we score these floorplans. Maybe we should be wary of plans without dimensions…I’ve seen and scored them. Probably not a good idea with these small spaces.
    I thought it important to bring up this point before voting got really heavy. I have no favorite at this time. I do feel the ‘Glas’ nominee is too large for the category of Loft/apartment/condo. It is as big as a small single family home. Wonder what would have been nominated in LA for this category if the square footage criteria wasn’t limited to 1000sq ft?

  • Margo

    [img]1_margotorontoloft.jpg[/img]

    Cheers,

    Margo

  • Corey

    [img]1_torontoloftfilemodel.jpg[/img]

    Attached is my revision of the Toronto Loft.

    Thanks!

  • JodiJ

    [img]1_week5desprojtostudentslayout11.jpg[/img]

    My reworked floor plan – Toronto Week 1

  • Sarah W

    [img]williamstorontoconverted.jpg[/img]

    Here is my rework o the Toronto loft.
    Thanks!

  • Vickie

    [img]vickieflplantoronto.jpg[/img]

    Hello all,
    Here is my floor plan for Toronto.

  • Terri

    MollyK,
    You’ve honed in on a common “trick” used in the design drawings for condos–the furniture is not to scale. Thanks for pointing it out in these examples today. It does throw a new light on judging them.

  • MollyK

    Thanks Terri,
    I’m not militant about scale, but when I saw both of those floorplans with such similar square footage and such DIFFERENT room configurations I was utterly confused…you know the experience when some voice in your head says “Wait a minute…something’s not right here.”
    I hope others will read my comment and look at all floorplans with a more discerning eye. I know it was a wake-up call for me…I have to remember the philosophy behind slow homes. It’s not just a pretty floorplan.

  • Mid America Mom

    Oh yes Orangeopolis’ comment on yesterday’s thread… Designer names and fancy naming- that is so true! I do get excited by the exterior and yes finishes , that is what they want not always how does it LIVE?

    Molly and Terri thanks for looking with such an eye! I have two points to add. I agree that we are seeing a lack of dimensions or not true to scale furniture and sadly there is more out there. Other issues: 1. An error with reported square footage. That happened today. The GLAS – that is NO way 1533 inside. EVEN including the amount of footage for stair I have it at 1296. As a buyer it is hard to truly compare other properties when this occurs as price per foot is one popular component in assessing value. *Never trust a blueprint or a property listing for the true dimensions. I am sure John can agree that onsite changes are expected and normal in new or reno projects. As for an existing property. In the listing we do not know where that was measuring from and to? Inside the closet, from a hearth or the back wall? And it can cost you. I almost fell victim to paying too much on a home due to that (300 feet off!). If you have to pay property tax they may use the square footage to determine. It may be used to calculate the building/community assessment fees. Moving on. 2. It is great that they include furniture in the floorplans, especially for those who have a hard time visualizing. BUT it also can steer us wrong when they place furniture where it would NEVER go. For example placing a chair in front of an exterior patio door- treating it like a wall and not a place of traffic. And Molly you brought up a double bed to the wall and space to move around as in the Charlie project. Another one I see all the time is the back of a couch or other piece of furniture less than 3/4 feet from stools at a breakfast bar.

    *Oh a trick for helping with scale if anyone needs it. I tend to look at two things to gauge scale (well being in the US and Canada). The dishwasher since 95% of them are for a space 2 by 2 feet. A basic bathtub is 2.5 by 5 feet. I tend to think of the furniture in relation to those. I know that a queen bed length is about the same width as the tub – 5, a dining chair almost as the dishwasher and so forth.

  • MollyK

    John and Matthew,
    Sent a comment to wrong date…sorry. Hope LA is nice. Was looking at Slow Home Map and Project list and found that 4 of my 5 loft submissions are missing. Checked others for Monday and found one more missing. Does that mean you did not received the submissions?

  • MollyK

    M.A.M
    Thanks for the scale information, very helpful. I just sent John a comment about my missing submissions. Couldn’t find Leo’s submission of Couture, Paris 964 either. All the others from Monday are there. You might look for all of yours just to see if any are missing.

  • Mid America Mom

    Oh- you mean as a Pin on the map or that list below? For a PIN we needed to put the full address.

  • Mid America Mom

    OH– Ok webmaster/John/matthew. Using Firefox I see Leo’s comments on Monday thread for Couture condo (http://www.monarchgroup.net/Community.aspx?CommunityID=433). We have 3 submissions for the same address but only two show on the google map and master list.

    Hope this helps

  • Mid America Mom

    [img]toloft3.jpg[/img]

    Here is my another submission of the loft plan from yesterday’s exercise.

    I placed the home within a lot :) We have a front stoop/entry porch. Toward the middle of the plan is the “courtyard”.

    Back to the front stoop. The walls on both side of you are to the ceiling but the new “entry” has the space for a door but does not have one, its wall is 7 ft high, and above that is clear glass to the ceiling. The thought is some of the natural light may make it to the space. In the “entry” is a hall table below a eye height window. This wall goes 7 feet and topped by glass.

    To your right is the sleeping wing. Here is the closet for the entry. Enter the bath. To the right is space for shelves and towels and yes that tub. At the back is a large vanity, linen closet, and access to a washer/ dryer space. This space can have a stacked or side by side unit in the 5 by 5 footprint. The bedroom is 10 by 11 with a 7 foot closet. The wall to the courtyard has one window, the wall goes 7 high and above that is glass to the ceiling.

    On the living part of the home is a kitchen that is 12 feet wide. Above the sink is a window to the front stoop. The living and dining space is also in this open floor area. The wall to the courtyard runs 7 feet high and glass to the ceiling. Toward the windows is a clear glass slider to the courtyard.

    The courtyard with its tile, natural light, and access to the balcony is a spot to relax. Here you can place plants, maybe a table for eating, or few chairs for relaxation.

    Another benefit to the windows is that they are operational- can be opened for any breeze that may enter the courtyard.

    I enjoyed thinking out of the box – with inspiration from material on this site.

  • Anonymous

    I am going to spoil my ballot – none of these three are worth voting for.

  • Mid America Mom

    Comment: What do you folks think of this one?

    Few more plans for our project. The front lobby has a wall of wood that looks quite interesting- they light it at night.

    Here is another development near Yonge and Bloor streets – great walk location and access to transit. This corner unit faces North with the bedrooms but east with living.

    Love this unit. Almost everything I see, I like. But Molly look at that master bedroom chair! The bedrooms can handle a queen bed and the closets are reasonable. The kitchen has a large island and open to the living space. We even have a fireplace and I would keep that chair close. Love reading in spots like that. The balcony wraps around the entire unit and has 4 access points. In the master bath the tub looks to be this large clawfoot. In their quest for greatness they forgot to give us a vanity that we can put something on. They did the same in the second bath. The entry closet is around a corner but your view is to the fireplace/living space and the view, I’ll it give it a YES. And here we have the dust bunny loving pillar in the corner.

    Sigh.

    Project Name: Casa

    Size: 1216

    Project Address: 45 Charles Street East Toronto ON

    Project URL: http://www.casacondominium.com/pdf/naples.pdf

    Slow Home Test Score: 17

  • Mid America Mom

    Comment: Had promise, south and west and a terrace. The living space is nice and the bedrooms are just right sized.
    But the entry is so long,the washer dryer- was that an after thought?, the kitchen is a single wall galley but they do have this eat in counter table going on..

    Project Name: Art Condo

    Size: 1051

    Project Address: 44 Dovercourt Rd Toronto ON

    Project URL: http://www.artcondos.ca/pdfs/ART_FP_D11.pdf

    Slow Home Test Score: 13

  • Mid America Mom

    Comment: This walkable downtown project is trying be green, and take a look at the clading on the side of the building.

    I choose a unit that faces North but if you take the 4th floor unit you look over the rooftop green space on the 3rd.

    Two split bedrooms and 2 baths on a corner. Entry is a view to outside and at least 5 wide. The second bath- with all that in it and that shallow, is it to code? The kitchen is a single wall galley – no surprise.

    Project Name: Luminere

    Size: 870

    Project Address: 770 bay Street Toronto ON

    Project URL: http://www.lumierecondos.com/pdf/golden_light_870_FP.pdf

    Slow Home Test Score: 16

  • Lacey

    [img]torontoloftfinal.jpg[/img]

    I apologize for the delay in getting this up. It slipped my mind that it hadn’t yet been actually posted.